Author Topic: Joule Ringer! (Read 834112 times)

Lynxsteam · « **Reply #450 on:** May 06, 2012, 08:02:08 PM »

I just checked the amp draw off a typical 12/120 volt inverter to power the same 14 watt CFL.
1.875 amps or 23 watts to power the bulb.

I also tried powering my Teslamp circuit with 12 volts. .372 amps or 4.68 watts, not any brighter than the 9 volt.

conradelektro · « **Reply #451 on:** May 06, 2012, 08:06:29 PM »

@SkyWatcher123:

Great, some more air coils! A retro trend is starting.

The nicety of air coils: one can build them at home rather easily and they seem to swing at a higher inaudible frequency above 100 KHz. May be the frequency comes down once really huge coils achieve an inductance comparable to ferrite core coils. But I hope that with a careful design one can build a more delicate circuit with a frequency above 100 KHz.

I have some smaller CFLs which only need 3 to 5 Watt at the 220V mains and seem to glow bright enough to be useful with 0,5 to 1 Watt on a super Joule Ringer type circuit. A retro lamp has to be dimmer to underline the 19th century atmosphere

.

Greetings, Conrad

SkyWatcher123 · « **Reply #452 on:** May 06, 2012, 09:28:17 PM »

Hi folks, Hi conrad, i tried the setup, though I think the 24 gauge main tower coil is too thick of a gauge wire to get the needed high voltage for the cfl.
I have 30 gauge wire, I am going to rewind the tower coil, will take a little while to wind it again.
peace love light
tyson

Magluvin · « **Reply #453 on:** May 06, 2012, 10:38:10 PM »

Quote from: SkyWatcher123 on May 06, 2012, 07:49:53 PM

Hi folks, Hi lynxsteam, thanks for sharing the lamp idea.
I happen to just finish a coil tower yesterday, though it has 24 gauge wire and is 9-1/2" tall X 3" diameter, it's a pringles chips can with metal bottom removed.
I'm going to make some tests starting with 24 gauge bifilar wrapped around bottom 1/4 of coil tower and see how it goes with your wiring setup, then try some different things just to see.
Here is a pic of the pringles chips tower.

peace love light
tyson

I wonder if the foil inside the pringles tube is conductive. Might be some loss there.

Pringles pizza flavor. ;]

Mags

Magluvin · « **Reply #454 on:** May 07, 2012, 01:01:16 AM »

Also those rings at the top and bottom of the can. They will suck the energy out before you can say "Pip" Get rid of those and make some scores in the inside of the can length wise. it should do, but i would even try to peal that inner layer off if you can. Ive seen setups with thicker wire and fewer turns do the job. Give it a try before you unwind. ;]

Mags

SkyWatcher123 · « **Reply #455 on:** May 07, 2012, 02:33:43 AM »

Hi folks, Hi magluvin, lol, no, sour cream and onion, hehe.
No i checked to see if the inner part was conductive, it is not and I removed the bottom metal cap, there was none on the top.
I finished rewinding with 30 awg wire and am using speaker wire for primary, just trying different wires and types, i think its 20 or 22 gauge, stranded of course.
I had enough single speaker wire piece for 25 turns, if this does not fire up, then i will add lynxsteam's trigger wire idea.
peace love light
tyson

conradelektro · « **Reply #456 on:** May 07, 2012, 04:59:59 PM »

A new 50 turn primary on my old 1000 turn (50 mm diameter) tower coil improved the output of the super Joule Ringer circuit.

Greetings, Conrad

Lynxsteam · « **Reply #457 on:** May 07, 2012, 05:58:00 PM »

That is a very similar result to what I am seeing. I only have 30 turns of primary. I will try 50 turns.
I tried my circuit with a 2N4401 transistor and it works well. ConradElektro, what transistor are you using?

conradelektro · « **Reply #458 on:** May 07, 2012, 07:34:34 PM »

Quote from: Lynxsteam on May 07, 2012, 05:58:00 PM

That is a very similar result to what I am seeing. I only have 30 turns of primary. I will try 50 turns.
I tried my circuit with a 2N4401 transistor and it works well. ConradElektro, what transistor are you using?

@Lynxsteam: at the moment I use the MJE13007 transistor (because it takes a lot of abuse when testing strange coils). Others are using the 2N3055, and I guess TIP3055 or TIP31 should work as well. I suspect the MJE13007 overheats to much in this type of circuit, so it probably is not the best choice.

The other day it came to my mind that this circuit will not fulfil the requirements of "radio regulations" because it emits a lot of stray emissions. I can light a blue LED with an Avramenco plug (no connection, just a piece of wire as an antenna and my body as virtual ground) up to 50 cm away from the coil. With 12 Volt operation the distance goes up to a meter. Some shielding will have to be done eventually. Using a ferrite core coil at e.g. 3 to 6 KHz will be not so critical in this respect, although the audible whine can be a nuisance.

Greetings, Conrad

Lynxsteam · « **Reply #459 on:** May 07, 2012, 07:45:24 PM »

I have always used the power transistors for this type of experimenting but recently learned a lot about small signal transistors from my work with wind turbine controllers. Whereas with power transistors being fully on or off, small signal transistors are amplifiers and are non-linear in the way they follow voltage. So by reducing voltage we can also reduce amperage draw. They also don't saturate the way power transistors do.
I will try your 50 turns idea later today and see how the power draw/brightness is affected.
Also I want to get back to 6 volts so I can solar charge easier.

Lynxsteam · « **Reply #460 on:** May 08, 2012, 02:45:30 PM »

I updated the circuit schematic for my Tesla Lamp. The trigger coil wasn't doing anything so I got rid of it. Its the HV feedback off the bulb that triggers the base as in Laser Saber's JRV2.0.
I tried a power transistor, switching 3055 and the results were about the same but slightly dimmer. I replaced the LED with a leaking diode 1N4148 and the bulb runs brighter. Also, the primary runs the full length of the secondary. 500 turns secondary, 25 turns primary.

The nice thing about a small signal amplifier transistor like a 2N2222 or 2N4401 is the CFL will light dimly with 2 volts and get brighter as the voltage goes up. Or conversely, as the battery runs down the circuit still gives off light.

There is nothing spectacular about this device. But what I like is that you can make one very simply with no exotic components and run it off a wide range of DC voltages.

http://youtu.be/fZtHdDWrM6E

conradelektro · « **Reply #461 on:** May 08, 2012, 04:43:46 PM »

Quote from: Lynxsteam on May 08, 2012, 02:45:30 PM

The nice thing about a small signal amplifier transistor like a 2N2222 or 2N4401 is the CFL will light dimly with 2 volts and get brighter as the voltage goes up. Or conversely, as the battery runs down the circuit still gives off light.

Thank you for showing your tests. Going through my collection of components I found the 2N4401 and the 2N2222, so I will make some tests with them.

At the moment I am building a new coil based on a plastic evacuation pipe with a diameter of 162 mm. For the secondary I will use two times 200 meter of silk insulated copper wire 0.3 mm2 (opposing coil halves, each halve about 380 turns). And for the primary I will try plastic insulated copper wire 1.5 mm2 as used for electrical installations (also opposing coil halves). The intention is to cover the secondary as much as possible with the primary, hence this massive wire.

Testing different ratios of turns (primary/secondary, the long secondary will be left unchanged because it is the more difficult to wind) I hope to be able to find a step up factor suitable for a 12 Volt power supply and a 220 Volt 9 Watt or 5 Watt LED-lamp.

The tubes of the CFLs (built in circuit removed) need at least 600 Volt. The LED lamps should work nicely with 220 Volt. The LED lamps should give the most light for a given wattage, even better than the CFLs.

Greetings, Conrad

b_rads · « **Reply #462 on:** May 08, 2012, 05:04:24 PM »

Quote from: Lynxsteam on May 08, 2012, 02:45:30 PM

I updated the circuit schematic for my Tesla Lamp. The trigger coil wasn't doing anything so I got rid of it. Its the HV feedback off the bulb that triggers the base as in Laser Saber's JRV2.0.

http://youtu.be/fZtHdDWrM6E

Thank You for the updated schematic. I attempted to replicate this last night and after watching your new video, I see some things I did wrong. I used 1" PVC - (Outside diameter measures 1 3/8") and wound 30g magnet wire 11". Do I need to remove some of this wire? Also I noted that the L1 is not tightly wrapped. Does this need to be loose? And Finally, the CFL that I gutted (13 watt) has two wires on each side. How does this connect? Sorry for all the questions, this is a newbie asking.

Lynxsteam · « **Reply #463 on:** May 08, 2012, 05:47:04 PM »

Nice Build! No, you didn't do anything wrong just need to make a few adjustments.

Your taller secondary probably has a lot more wire than mine so you will probably need to increase your primary windings to 30-50 and then adjust from there.
I do this by starting with an plastic insulated wire from the positive lead around the bottom of the tower and winding up. Keep it a little loose and wind to the top. There will be space between turns. Keep the end long for now so you can add more turns if needed. Temporarily connect this ending L1 wire from the top down to the emitter of your transistor. Use an alligator clip.
Make sure your HV (high voltage) wire is clean of insulation a 1/2" back. Heat and sandpaper til you get to copper.
It matters that the correct ends off the secondary go where shown.
On the CFL twist the two leads from each tube together with the correct HV wire. After the HV passes through the CFL it goes down and connects to the Base of the transistor with a 12" or so piece of 30 awg wire.
It matters which way the diode goes. Make sure the positive mark is towards the base of the transistor.
Mine will start right up with 2 volts all the way up to 15 volts.
You will probably be able to light more CFL bulbs than I can, but you will push the transistor to its ma limit. The 4401 is good for 500 ma, the 2222 is good for 680 ma. Start testing with 6 volts and work up and down testing. Hopefully you have a couple spare transistors because we all burn them up testing. Once you get it working and adjusted, solder and glue gun everything tidy.

b_rads · « **Reply #464 on:** May 08, 2012, 08:56:28 PM »

Quote from: Lynxsteam on May 08, 2012, 05:47:04 PM

Nice Build! No, you didn't do anything wrong just need to make a few adjustments.

Your taller secondary probably has a lot more wire than mine so you will probably need to increase your primary windings to 30-50 and then adjust from there.
I do this by starting with an plastic insulated wire from the positive lead around the bottom of the tower and winding up. Keep it a little loose and wind to the top. There will be space between turns. Keep the end long for now so you can add more turns if needed. Temporarily connect this ending L1 wire from the top down to the emitter of your transistor. Use an alligator clip.
Make sure your HV (high voltage) wire is clean of insulation a 1/2" back. Heat and sandpaper til you get to copper.
It matters that the correct ends off the secondary go where shown.
On the CFL twist the two leads from each tube together with the correct HV wire. After the HV passes through the CFL it goes down and connects to the Base of the transistor with a 12" or so piece of 30 awg wire.
It matters which way the diode goes. Make sure the positive mark is towards the base of the transistor.
Mine will start right up with 2 volts all the way up to 15 volts.
You will probably be able to light more CFL bulbs than I can, but you will push the transistor to its ma limit. The 4401 is good for 500 ma, the 2222 is good for 680 ma. Start testing with 6 volts and work up and down testing. Hopefully you have a couple spare transistors because we all burn them up testing. Once you get it working and adjusted, solder and glue gun everything tidy.

Your suggestions are greatly appreciated. I have several of both transistors you mentioned. I will attempt to get this running this evening - with some luck. I hope to be able to run this off the USB port on several devices I have. 5 Volts off my 12 Volt battery that is solar charged would be nice, or even my laptop USB. Correct me if I misunderstand this calculation - Volts X Amps = Watts. 6 volts X .2 Amps (200 mA) = 1.2 watts to light a 13/14 watt CFL. If light output is similiar, this sounds pretty darn efficient to me. Thanks again,
Brad S

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Author Topic: Joule Ringer! (Read 834112 times)

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