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Author Topic: Re-Inventing The Wheel-Part1-Clemente_Figuera-THE INFINITE ENERGY MACHINE  (Read 2334322 times)

bajac

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Re: Re-Inventing The Wheel-Part1-Clemente_Figuera-THE INFINITE ENERGY MACHINE
« Reply #1455 on: August 19, 2014, 01:49:41 PM »
Hello guys,
I have to apologize because I been off the forum for so long but I am still very busy with other personal matters that require 100% of my time. Nevertheless, I took couple of weeks to write the paper being attached to this reply. It is my interpretation of how the Figuera's rotary generator might have worked. In summary, Figuera's teachings for this generator consists in constructing the induced coils with non-magnetic/non-metallic cores. Even though it is the simplest of his inventions, it took me longer to figure this device out. It is very interesting and it seems to me that this is the simplest of his invention, to date. A friend of mine is building this generator and he will post the results of the testing process. I estimate the results to be ready  by the end of this year, 2014.
Thanks, again. And good luck to all.
Bajac

I noticed that there are errors in the document:

Page 14: the third line of the middle paragraph should read "...the solenoid shown in Figure 6b can be as high as 2,500...", 

Page 20: lines 5 and 6 should read "...can run with only 2,000 Watts of input power representing a power gain of 250."

When the relative permeability was derated from 2,500 to 250, the input power becomes 2,000 W and not 400 W as stated in the first draft of the document.

« Last Edit: August 20, 2014, 01:31:08 AM by bajac »

RandyFL

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Re: Re-Inventing The Wheel-Part1-Clemente_Figuera-THE INFINITE ENERGY MACHINE
« Reply #1456 on: August 20, 2014, 01:10:05 AM »
Hello All

Hello Bajac:
Its always interesting to meet people who contribute so much to this/these forum/s...
I downloaded your document and will study it at an opportune time.
I am in the process of building the Clemente F. and very much interested in someone who has built one...
I tell people in my Local area that the least I expect of the device is a useful way of using a 12 volt car battery. As most ppl don't know what overunity means...
My biggest problem here in Florida was finding iron...
Have you built the Fig. and have you had success with it?

All the Best
RandyFL

bajac

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Re: Re-Inventing The Wheel-Part1-Clemente_Figuera-THE INFINITE ENERGY MACHINE
« Reply #1457 on: August 20, 2014, 01:11:12 PM »
Randy,
I have not finished the prototype of the 1908 invention. I did get some interesting results and learned some behavior of this apparatus by fine tuning, little changes, etc. Finaly, I realized that I have to rebuilt the unit with different specifications for the iron core. I have limited resources and I exhausted my budget for this year. I hope I can start the construction of a new one by the middle of next year, 2015. I have only built one section of the transformer. It is my understanding that each section should provide overunity. If I did not get the expected results from a section, I would not continue on building more sections. Does that make sense?
Meanwhile, a friend of mine was very interested in building the apparatus that I showed in Figure 9 but with the modifications shwon in Figures 11a and 11b. I gave this friend some sketches with dimensions similar to shop drawings ready for constructions. He promised me that he will post the results of this device. I cannot wait for them.
I also wanted to ask a question related to this website. How can I get the administrator to replace the file attached with my reply #1455 with an updated version?  I found out that the document needed more descriptions such as the application of equation 1.
Thank you!
Bajac

RandyFL

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Re: Re-Inventing The Wheel-Part1-Clemente_Figuera-THE INFINITE ENERGY MACHINE
« Reply #1458 on: August 20, 2014, 01:36:01 PM »
20 August 14       07:22:00

Hello All/Bajac:
Since I didn't/don't have a background in electricity or electronics I labored to get the solid state device to work ( I almost gave up, Patrick K went into retirement and my electronics engineer friend had died )...
I did the Edison approach until it worked for me. And when Patrick K advised me to hook it up to a 12 car battery my low current 555 melted and some of the breadboard...   :-).......I love watching things go pppppsssstttt.
Anyway as I have stated here before my biggest problem is/was locating iron ( who would have thunk... in America it would be hard to get iron ). Hence I have slowed down in my procedures and am taking my time...when you showed up.
I have wound all my transformers and will rebuild my circuit and will be ready to test somewhere down the road...
was wondering what experiences and successes you had...

All the Best
RandtFL

bajac

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Re: Re-Inventing The Wheel-Part1-Clemente_Figuera-THE INFINITE ENERGY MACHINE
« Reply #1459 on: August 20, 2014, 06:40:54 PM »
ATTACHED IS THE UPDATED VERSION! REVION 1.
The document was revised to correct some errors and to add more description on the application of equation 1.
Thanks.

marathonman

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Re: Re-Inventing The Wheel-Part1-Clemente_Figuera-THE INFINITE ENERGY MACHINE
« Reply #1460 on: August 20, 2014, 06:53:04 PM »
Hello all,
So what you are saying Bajac is that in figure 12 of your PDF that the output coil on the stator is wound on a non metallic bobbin as most are but that the bobbin is on  top of the stator not around it so that there is a gap between the rotor and the stator and that's where the output coil resides on the non metallic bobbin. (yes/No)
and thank you for the Flynn information to.


bajac

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Re: Re-Inventing The Wheel-Part1-Clemente_Figuera-THE INFINITE ENERGY MACHINE
« Reply #1461 on: August 20, 2014, 07:19:37 PM »
Marathonman,
The center of the bobbin shall also be non-magnetic/non-metallic. I thought it was clear but it seems that it will need to be revised to indicate that the iron core does not penetrate the center of the bobbins.
 
Thanks.

marathonman

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Re: Re-Inventing The Wheel-Part1-Clemente_Figuera-THE INFINITE ENERGY MACHINE
« Reply #1462 on: August 20, 2014, 08:25:09 PM »
I got that and thank you VERY, VERY much Bajac and we (the forum) are forever grateful for you contributions.

Cadman

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Re: Re-Inventing The Wheel-Part1-Clemente_Figuera-THE INFINITE ENERGY MACHINE
« Reply #1463 on: August 20, 2014, 09:46:05 PM »
Bajac,

Just some thoughts...

Have you taken into account the dramatic increase in reluctance and therefore the field coil ampere turns required for your designs?

For instance by my calculations, a field pole with a face surface of 44.61 cm^2 and an air gap in the magnetic circuit of 0.0254 cm (0.010”) will require about 176 ampere turns for a gap flux density of 7900 lines per cm^2 in my generator. The same surface with a gap in the magnetic circuit of 1.27 cm (0.50”) will require more than 8800 ampere turns on the field coil to produce the same flux density in the gap.

The reduced flux density cut by the induced may be part of the reason for the decrease in power consumed to rotate the induced, but since the E.M.F. generated in one conductor moving through a magnetic field is equal to the total number of lines cut per second, divided by 10^8, it seems like a poor trade.

I'm not trying to discredit your work, just curious about how you dealt with this. Or perhaps you already said in your paper and I am too dense to see it? :)

Regards

bajac

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Re: Re-Inventing The Wheel-Part1-Clemente_Figuera-THE INFINITE ENERGY MACHINE
« Reply #1464 on: August 21, 2014, 12:16:52 AM »
Cadman,


I am not sure if I understood your question or concern. However, you need to compare apples with apples.


How come an issue related to the design and the construction details of the permanent magnets or electromagnets can invalidate or discredit the proposed concept for decreasing torque when using non-magnetic cores in the induced coil? The examples provided in the document do not explicitly take into account the power required to operate the magnets but the tolerance provided when the relative permeability was decreased by a factor of ten should be a good conservative contingency to account for any power consumed by the electromagnets. Anyway, it is a point well taken and I will include it in my next revision of the document.


On the other hand, I have the impression that you are giving up before trying. I really do not think that it will be that bad with the electromagnets. There are others important parameters that you are not taking into account. For instance, it is difficult to estimate how the cancellation effect of the Lenz's law will be present. As you already know, the induced field reacts to cancel the applied magnetic field which forces the applied magnetic field to be made larger. Because the induced magnetic field is substantially reduced when not using iron cores, then the cancellation of the fields should be smaller. The latter might allow operation with smaller magnets.


I am just speculating here but the final saying will be made by the results from the testing of a prototype. Remember that we do not really know this device that has been out of sight for more than a century. That is what makes it a challenge and exciting!


Thanks for your comments.

forest

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Re: Re-Inventing The Wheel-Part1-Clemente_Figuera-THE INFINITE ENERGY MACHINE
« Reply #1465 on: August 21, 2014, 11:44:50 AM »
Bajac,

Just some thoughts...

Have you taken into account the dramatic increase in reluctance and therefore the field coil ampere turns required for your designs?

For instance by my calculations, a field pole with a face surface of 44.61 cm^2 and an air gap in the magnetic circuit of 0.0254 cm (0.010”) will require about 176 ampere turns for a gap flux density of 7900 lines per cm^2 in my generator. The same surface with a gap in the magnetic circuit of 1.27 cm (0.50”) will require more than 8800 ampere turns on the field coil to produce the same flux density in the gap.

The reduced flux density cut by the induced may be part of the reason for the decrease in power consumed to rotate the induced, but since the E.M.F. generated in one conductor moving through a magnetic field is equal to the total number of lines cut per second, divided by 10^8, it seems like a poor trade.

I'm not trying to discredit your work, just curious about how you dealt with this. Or perhaps you already said in your paper and I am too dense to see it? :)

Regards

Valid points..though...can you answer how much of this 7900 lines of flux density is "consumed" to do work to break the magnetic dipole of two inducer cores many times per second ?

Cadman

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Re: Re-Inventing The Wheel-Part1-Clemente_Figuera-THE INFINITE ENERGY MACHINE
« Reply #1466 on: August 21, 2014, 06:53:06 PM »
Hi Bajac,

I think I am not expressing myself clearly. That and my questions are more from a cost of construction concern than a theoretical one. No discredit intended about the concept for decreasing torque either, in fact I agree 100% with your reasoning there. And 100% agree the non metallic non magnetic core of the induced coils will result in much less force required to rotate it. Never the less it takes a certain number of wires or bars cutting a certain number of lines of flux per second to produce the desired output, so reducing the flux density has the effect of reducing the output. In my eyes moving the core of the field pole far enough away from the induced to insert the field coil (not the induced) in that space will have an adverse impact on the output. I am referring to your figure 8b and 12 concept designs by the way. There are ways to offset that impact for sure, but every one I can think of is costly. These are just my opinions of course.

Anyway I am not giving up. Just the opposite. I have been convinced of the validity of the Figuera and Buforn designs from the first time I read the patents. In fact the more I research the techniques and knowledge used to build dynamos at the beginning of the 20th century, the more certain I become because the patent designs fit and fit well.

The only reason I bypassed the 1902 design was for practical reasons, not having the resources to build it the way I think it should be built. Besides, someone more qualified is already working on that one. :)
I am going with the 1908 design because I believe a practical device with substantial output can be built for much less cost. It's past the investigation and analyses stage and I am close to finishing the first prototype calculations. After that the blueprints (now there is an obsolete term) and then construction.

You are right, it is challenging and exciting. I am very much looking forward to the tests of your prototype and hope it is a resounding success!


Cadman

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Re: Re-Inventing The Wheel-Part1-Clemente_Figuera-THE INFINITE ENERGY MACHINE
« Reply #1467 on: August 21, 2014, 06:58:52 PM »
Valid points..though...can you answer how much of this 7900 lines of flux density is "consumed" to do work to break the magnetic dipole of two inducer cores many times per second ?

Hmmm... my guess would be, none.

Cheers

Edit: That's a trick question, right?


shadow119g

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Re: Re-Inventing The Wheel-Part1-Clemente_Figuera-THE INFINITE ENERGY MACHINE
« Reply #1468 on: August 21, 2014, 08:18:00 PM »
Here is a company that may have the iron we are looking for.
I haven't contacted them because I am working on another
project.

http://www.edfagan.com/vim-var-core-iron-rod.php

Sorry it didn't come out as a link.

Good luck all,

Swamp

Cadman

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