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Author Topic: Quantum Energy Generator (QEG) Open Sourced (by HopeGirl)  (Read 1998103 times)

isim

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Re: Quantum Energy Generator (QEG) Open Sourced (by HopeGirl)
« Reply #2025 on: July 28, 2014, 12:10:13 AM »
@TinselKoala
"Ok, that's expected. Now I believe that the true phase angle should be close to 90 degrees, probably around 87 degrees. A couple of different measurements have arrived at the 72 degree value, though, like this most recent one with the CSR. I would like to be able to "balance the books" if you know what I mean. So what can account for the reduced phase angle I seem to be measuring on the scope? How can I tease out the separate contributions to the phase angle measurement, without spending any money or developing special instrumentation buffer amps and filter networks? "

I do a simulation of your miniQEG, and I found that to have a Phase shift of 74° (approximately), I need to load the OC(oscillating circuit) with a serial resistor of approximately r=1.5ohm (plus R=0.25ohm). For me this resistor is:
1) an default in your circuit. (I don't thinks so)
2) an external load, your "receptor" for example.
3) an other parasitic load???
If this resistor is <0.5ohm the shift phase become 87°...
I will give you more information and pictures tomorrow evening.
Can you do a test with and without the "receptor"?
Thanks
@+

TinselKoala

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Re: Quantum Energy Generator (QEG) Open Sourced (by HopeGirl)
« Reply #2026 on: July 28, 2014, 01:52:37 AM »
@TinselKoala
"Ok, that's expected. Now I believe that the true phase angle should be close to 90 degrees, probably around 87 degrees. A couple of different measurements have arrived at the 72 degree value, though, like this most recent one with the CSR. I would like to be able to "balance the books" if you know what I mean. So what can account for the reduced phase angle I seem to be measuring on the scope? How can I tease out the separate contributions to the phase angle measurement, without spending any money or developing special instrumentation buffer amps and filter networks? "

I do a simulation of your miniQEG, and I found that to have a Phase shift of 74° (approximately), I need to load the OC(oscillating circuit) with a serial resistor of approximately r=1.5ohm (plus R=0.25ohm). For me this resistor is:
1) an default in your circuit. (I don't thinks so)
2) an external load, your "receptor" for example.
3) an other parasitic load???
If this resistor is <0.5ohm the shift phase become 87°...
I will give you more information and pictures tomorrow evening.
Can you do a test with and without the "receptor"?
Thanks
@+
I've tried to keep the tank circuit current paths as short and symmetrical as possible and I'm using heavy conductors and huge copper areas on the PCB. I am pretty sure there isn't any great resistance introduced in this current path by my construction.These most recent measurements were done with IRF830 mosfets though. Could the higher Rdss of these mosfets be the "missing resistance" in the tank circuit to account for the phase discrepancy? But the mosfets are in screw-clamp sockets for ease of replacement, these may be introducing a little bit of series resistance over what a soldered connection would do.

As far as I can tell by casually looking at the scope, the presence or absence of an external load, the "receptor" driving a lamp or motor, doesn't affect the phase angle, just the amplitudes of V and I and the frequency slightly. The phase measurements above were made with the receptor and light bulb in place but not driving the motor.

ETA: This turns out to be incorrect, there is a phase difference whether or not the motor load is being driven. See below.

Yes, later this evening I will be happy to do some actual phase angle measurements with and without the receptor driving a heavy load. But I am all out of really low Rdss mosfets and will have to stay with the 830s until tomorrow, when my replacement 3205s are scheduled to arrive.

In your simulation, I imagine you cannot simulate the Tesla Bifilar winding of the primary tank's loop. I will also make another loop coil with ordinary solenoidal winding but the same amount of wire, for comparison. But of course that will remove the "tesla magic" from my  apparatus.
 :-[
« Last Edit: July 28, 2014, 05:16:11 AM by TinselKoala »

TinselKoala

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Re: Quantum Energy Generator (QEG) Open Sourced (by HopeGirl)
« Reply #2027 on: July 28, 2014, 02:04:46 AM »
I suspect that any erroneous phase shift is caused by:

1) Induction loop between scope probe commons and the scope chassis, and/or
2) Parasitic loading of the voltage measurement.

I would try the following:

Make up a 501:1 50 Ohm resistor divider ( 25K Ohm / 50 Ohm ), with the common side of the 50 Ohm reistor to the current probe common and use that with straight coax to the scope set for 50 Ohms at the input.  The 25K load will be very light on the 75V pp signal, and you will still have 150mV pp to work with.
I think I'm following you here but it would be nice, just to be sure, if you could sketch up a little diagram of the divider and the connections to DUT and scope.

The Tek 2213a's inputs are hardwired to 1 megohm impedance, and so are the HP180a's and the RM503's. I think I can set the Link DSO's input impedance to 50 ohms, let me fire it up and check.

ETA: Nope, the Link inputs are also hardwired at 1 Meg, 5 pf.

MarkE

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Re: Quantum Energy Generator (QEG) Open Sourced (by HopeGirl)
« Reply #2028 on: July 28, 2014, 02:34:27 AM »
I think I'm following you here but it would be nice, just to be sure, if you could sketch up a little diagram of the divider and the connections to DUT and scope.

The Tek 2213a's inputs are hardwired to 1 megohm impedance, and so are the HP180a's and the RM503's. I think I can set the Link DSO's input impedance to 50 ohms, let me fire it up and check.

ETA: Nope, the Link inputs are also hardwired at 1 Meg, 5 pf.
At 50 Ohms, the divider impedance should be low enough that it is essentially unaffected at 300kHz by a normal 10X probe.  The 10 Meg resistor is optional.  Without it, the attenuation is 501V/V instead of 500V/V.

TinselKoala

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Re: Quantum Energy Generator (QEG) Open Sourced (by HopeGirl)
« Reply #2029 on: July 28, 2014, 03:43:48 AM »
OK.... thanks for making the diagram... I'll see what I can do.

Meanwhile the motor load in the "receptor" or TKTransverter does cause some phase shift from the non-loaded state. Here are two shots comparing "receptor with motor load" and "no receptor at all". The external loopstick lighting the three LEDs is operating for both shots though.

This is the best x-y display that the old Link DSO will give me. I can't make quantitative measurements of phase angle from that Lissajous figure, except to say that the "no load" one is almost perfectly circular indicating 90 degrees phase angle. But I may be able to do it with cursors and math on the time-domain screen. Let me fiddle around a bit.

TinselKoala

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Re: Quantum Energy Generator (QEG) Open Sourced (by HopeGirl)
« Reply #2030 on: July 28, 2014, 04:08:45 AM »
At 50 Ohms, the divider impedance should be low enough that it is essentially unaffected at 300kHz by a normal 10X probe.  The 10 Meg resistor is optional.  Without it, the attenuation is 501V/V instead of 500V/V.

Ok.. but let's back up a square or two.

If I remove the 0R25 CVR and go back to the unadulterated tank circuit, I can get an accurate measure of the voltage swing in the tank simply by connecting the 10x probe with its 1 meg impedance and its about 25 pF capacitance directly across the coil. This measurement will be phase shifted very slightly by the probe, but if both channels use matched probes these shifts should be equal in both channels, right?

But... if I have an accurate measure of the voltage swing in the tank, this is _also_ equivalent to the Vdrop across the tank's impedance, isn't it? And thus this waveform can be converted into the _amplitude_ waveform of the current, by the AC version of Ohm's Law. All that is lacking for the power determination is the true phase of the calculated current waveform wrt the measured voltage waveform. Both have been shown to be pure sinusoids. So, if the impedance is known, and the phase angle is known (from some other measurement that may not provide current amplitude information) the real power can be calculated by the Vrms * Irms * cos(theta) equation.  Right?
Several different methods have shown that the current p-p amplitude is in the 8-10 A range. The most best method of determining the true phase angle comes up with right about 90 degrees unloaded and about 72 degrees loaded. I think.

So is it actually possible to dispense with dividers and CSRs and such, and actually use the loop itself as its own current monitor, and derive the true current amplitude as described above? And is there some other, non-intrusive, way of confirming the true phase shift in the signals themselves, as opposed to the measurements of the signals?

I do have a 100x probe, brand new, if that will help at all.

MarkE

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Re: Quantum Energy Generator (QEG) Open Sourced (by HopeGirl)
« Reply #2031 on: July 28, 2014, 04:50:05 AM »
Ok.. but let's back up a square or two.

If I remove the 0R25 CVR and go back to the unadulterated tank circuit, I can get an accurate measure of the voltage swing in the tank simply by connecting the 10x probe with its 1 meg impedance and its about 25 pF capacitance directly across the coil. This measurement will be phase shifted very slightly by the probe, but if both channels use matched probes these shifts should be equal in both channels, right?

But... if I have an accurate measure of the voltage swing in the tank, this is _also_ equivalent to the Vdrop across the tank's impedance, isn't it? And thus this waveform can be converted into the _amplitude_ waveform of the current, by the AC version of Ohm's Law. All that is lacking for the power determination is the true phase of the calculated current waveform wrt the measured voltage waveform. Both have been shown to be pure sinusoids. So, if the impedance is known, and the phase angle is known (from some other measurement that may not provide current amplitude information) the real power can be calculated by the Vrms * Irms * cos(theta) equation.  Right?
Several different methods have shown that the current p-p amplitude is in the 8-10 A range. The most best method of determining the true phase angle comes up with right about 90 degrees unloaded and about 72 degrees loaded. I think.

So is it actually possible to dispense with dividers and CSRs and such, and actually use the loop itself as its own current monitor, and derive the true current amplitude as described above? And is there some other, non-intrusive, way of confirming the true phase shift in the signals themselves, as opposed to the measurements of the signals?

I do have a 100x probe, brand new, if that will help at all.
You are getting loaded down somewhere that is not clear.  I ran some numbers on representative scope probe models and garden variety 10X probes should not be causing the amount of phase shift from 90 degrees that you are seeing.  Some thought is required.

TinselKoala

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Re: Quantum Energy Generator (QEG) Open Sourced (by HopeGirl)
« Reply #2032 on: July 28, 2014, 05:01:07 AM »
You are getting loaded down somewhere that is not clear.  I ran some numbers on representative scope probe models and garden variety 10X probes should not be causing the amount of phase shift from 90 degrees that you are seeing.  Some thought is required.
Well, think about this then. Phase angle data derived from cursor positions wrt the zero-crossings of the two signals, using the 10x probes, in two conditions: TKTransverter (receptor) in place driving light and motor; and no receptor in place. Measurements taken within minutes of each other, basically just time taking the screenshots.


TinselKoala

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Re: Quantum Energy Generator (QEG) Open Sourced (by HopeGirl)
« Reply #2033 on: July 28, 2014, 06:11:55 AM »
Ah... how about this as a source of artifact:

I used my two newest probes, a matched set of cheapo P6100 100 MHz labeled items, for the Link DSO measurements above. But for the earlier, analog measurements I used a different set of probes, not matched, one is marked P2100 100 MHz and is switchable 1x/10x and has the trimcap in the BNC connector end, and the other is "API" brand, 10x only, not switchable and has the trimcap in the probe body.

So this is probably a big "fail" and I need to repeat the analog measurements with the matched p6100s, or the digital measurements with the unmatched set, to check for probe artifacts. Ah well, another pot of coffee....


-----------------------------------------
ETA: Nope, that's not it. I used the unmatched probes to make the same measurements as above, and got the same results: Unloaded, right at 90 degrees, and Loaded, around 82 degrees.

So, is my Tek 2213a somehow lying to me?

ETA2: Hmmmmmm.... maybe it's just my technique, or the phase of the moon or something. Now, the Tek is giving me almost the same result as the DSO, quite near 90 degrees unloaded and a few degrees less, not 18 or 20, for the loaded situation, using the unmatched probe set as before.

So I'm assigning a possible range, based on these more precise measurements: Unloaded, the phase angle is between 88 and 90 degrees. Loaded it is between 81 and 83 degrees.  I may be able to get more precise than that with more careful use of the DSO, but this is actually close enough for my purposes.

MarkE

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Re: Quantum Energy Generator (QEG) Open Sourced (by HopeGirl)
« Reply #2034 on: July 28, 2014, 07:07:53 AM »
Any load that dissipates energy should pull the thing off of 90 degrees.  That includes internal dissipation.  The 90.8 degrees is believable.  The greater the actual load power the less the resonator rings, which of course you know. 

TinselKoala

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Re: Quantum Energy Generator (QEG) Open Sourced (by HopeGirl)
« Reply #2035 on: July 28, 2014, 07:20:06 AM »
Any load that dissipates energy should pull the thing off of 90 degrees.  That includes internal dissipation.  The 90.8 degrees is believable.  The greater the actual load power the less the resonator rings, which of course you know.
Of course, and that is one of the points of this whole exploration. One can indeed convert the resonant tank's "Overunity in VARs" into Real Power that can power a load and be dissipated in the load. But as one increases the load, the "OU" drops and drops, until one is drawing power out of the tank as fast as the prime mover source can replace it and there is no voltage rise in the resonant tank. The QEG's Q has plummeted, turned into a zero, so to speak.

Note that the MicroQEG automagically adjusts its resonant frequency, compensating for the changes in load, to stay in a true resonant condition. The FTW QEG, being mechanically pumped at its resonant frequency, will require some kind of phase-locked motor controller system to compensate for the change in the tank resonant frequency as the load on its output changes. But of course they will never even get that far, since they won't be able to extract anything like 100 percent of the mechanical input power to the parametric oscillator, their system is so lossy.

ETA: Internal dissipation: So the use of the IRF830, with its Rdss of 1.5 ohms, is probably the source of the "problem". The IRF3205, which I started with and will use again as soon as they arrive, has 0.008 ohm Rdss.

TinselKoala

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Re: Quantum Energy Generator (QEG) Open Sourced (by HopeGirl)
« Reply #2036 on: July 28, 2014, 09:44:58 AM »
Wow. Just wow.
Here are a couple quotes from HypeGirl back in April.

Quote
FIX THE WORLD PUBLIC STATEMENT:
We are not in the prove it business, we are in the do it business. We are doing the work, teaching others how to do it and showing the process so that it is available to all. The most important thing is to get this technology directly into the hands of the people, which is what we are doing. Our working prototype will be proven to the world through the people who believe in free energy enough to do the work needed to bring it out of suppression. Therefore the people will be the ones to make the announcements, which will be more effective, and the people will get all the glory.
130 years ago, Nikola Tesla designed an over unity fuelless generator  that could provide enough power to power your home. This technology was heavily suppressed as a way to control the people of this planet through dependence on oil.  Tesla’s designs and patents are in the public domain.
Through research, study, help from others, divine inspiration, and over 30 years of electronics engineering experience, James Robitaille of the Fix the World Organization (FTW) took one 1-hour class with an organization who has been building (and suppressing) these generators for over 20 years, and was able to figure out how to build it.  We raised the money for the prototype through crowdfunding and donations from over 1,000 people who believed in us. It took us 5 months to build the prototype, and once we got raw power, on March 25th of 2014 we open sourced the plans and gave away the technology to the world.  Our Quantum Energy Generator (QEG) provides 10KW of power output for less than 1KW input, which it supplies to itself. Now that this raw power source is achieved and shared so freely, there will be many variations and improvements. Humanity will be co-developing the future of the QEG, and will be free from the enslavement of the oil and energy industries.


Quote
Immediately after open sourcing the Fix the World QEG family attended a Prepare for Change Cobra conference in Taipei. We showed a presentation video of the QEG working prototype. Many who attended that conference are spreading the QEG knowledge all over the world. Cobra and his contacts from the light forces came to the factory where we are building QEGs to observe the operation for themselves. They are very impressed and we have the full backing and support of the Resistance Movement. Plans for larger scale production and parts sourcing are underway.
 
Teams of engineers are forming in more countries than we can count to build QEG’s.  Our first hands on experience is here in Taiwan with a group of engineers, many of which came from China who plan to bring the knowledge back to China. These “Men of China” have spent a small fortune and waited for a month just to get Visas to be here in Taiwan for QEG training. They have raised a large sum of money to begin QEG production in China. We were told from a high level contact that the QEG plans will be shared with 5,000 engineers in China who will be making as many innovations on the QEG as possible and open sourcing the plans for each one.
 Already we have seen plans for improvements and innovations to the QEG, the engineers of the world are taking full creative license on what can be done once you have achieved an over unity power source. Many are very excited.
One of our suppliers Torelco, is extremely excited about the high demand for processed cores, and many orders have been placed in the last week from all over the world. They are rearranging their workforce  to handle the demand and working to get the best possible price for people.  They are charging $3,000 for the complete processed core which is a great price, and does not include shipping.
 We recommend Torelco for purchasing a finished core which includes laminated steel core and rotor, all mica components, magnet wire, sleeving, spacer blocks, mylar tape and outerwrap tape, 8 inch through-bolts, nuts, washers, Nomex corner insulation and toroidal winding. Since open sourcing, we have learned that our other supplier, Polaris, will charge you double for the bare generator sets. Torelco will give you a much better price for a bare core as well.   As FTW continues to roll out the distribution plan, and more connections across the world are made, we think CICUs will be commonplace and hence, QEG parts will be more accessible (many people will be making them!)
 Please Watch for Updated User Manuals as development progresses. They will be here: http://www.fixtheworldproject.net/qeg-open-source-documents.html


Quote
FTW Next Steps for QEG
We are getting more questions than we can answer individually, and we want to help as much as we can. To help with this information flow we will be doing a free weekly radio show with James Robitaille and HopeGirl on Mission I’m Possible Radio called “Ask James about the QEG”. Here, people can call in or send questions that James and Hope will answer on the air. The shows will be archived, and we will find a transcriber to type out all of the Questions and Answers and post them in forums for others to find the answers they need. Check the radio station for scheduled show times: http://www.blogtalkradio.com/expandinguradio
(emphasis mine)

All this, and more, back in April.

http://be-do.com/index.php/en/14-sample-data-articles/119-the-quantum-energy-generator


But now we see the origins: Robitaille took a one hour class from Timmy Thrapp, during which he no doubt saw a brief presentation of Timmy's "running" QEG. And since Jamie paid (or had someone else pay) a _lot_ of money for the class, of course the information received is highly valued. It's an old trick of marketing.


There is one good thing that will come of all of this, once the dust settles and everyone admits that the things just won't actually work and never have. It will make people more skeptical of Timothy Thrapp and WITTS and their stable full of OU FE machines... that somehow don't prevent them from having to pay an electric bill every month just like everyone else.




 




synchro1

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Re: Quantum Energy Generator (QEG) Open Sourced (by HopeGirl)
« Reply #2037 on: July 28, 2014, 06:11:24 PM »
@Tinselkoala,


"I will also make another loop coil with ordinary solenoidal winding but the same amount of wire, for comparison. But of course that will remove the "tesla magic" from my  apparatus".

I'll bet you any amount of money it won't work!

PCB

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Re: Quantum Energy Generator (QEG) Open Sourced (by HopeGirl)
« Reply #2038 on: July 28, 2014, 08:40:31 PM »
There is a recent post suggesting that successfully "conditioning" the QEG using the exciter coil to achieve OU could take weeks, months and possibly even years - various reference sources are sited to prove there point of view. They point to the fact that the exciter coil is not required once conditioned. We are now in the realm of metaphysics and religion, and this is the perfect out for Hopeless Girl and Jamie. I guess they will set up a commune or some thing on "all that land they have."

The whole thing has already gone tits up. The Florida guys have not been heard from in quite a while after posting several videos measuring reactive power. There is no further news from the UK or from any other place that built one of these boat anchors. Even South Africa which was days away from achieving resonance has been quite for over three weeks. Nothing from Canada either. I think these teams quickly realize that this is a crock of @$#% and are too embarrassed to show their face again on the be-do forum. Activity on be-do has dried up to just a few new posts each day, mostly speculating on what will happen when they achieve OU. After all if I had dumped $10K into three cores like Orlando team did I would not what to show my face again either.

It may be the case that these teams do share their results back on the forum but they get censored out and are never made public. I suspect they are simply cut off.

MarkE

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Re: Quantum Energy Generator (QEG) Open Sourced (by HopeGirl)
« Reply #2039 on: July 28, 2014, 08:47:12 PM »
Don't be too surprised if the next revelation from the  from the Robitailles is that there machine will only achieve overunity when it incorporates a working EESTOR capacitor.