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Author Topic: Nathan Stubblefield Earth battery/Self Generating Induction Coil Replications  (Read 1723569 times)

protonmom

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Re: Nathan Stubblefield Earth battery/Self Generating Induction Coil Replications
« Reply #3135 on: February 25, 2010, 03:35:34 PM »
LaserSaber,
That looks like a very interesting gizmo you are making for your make and break.  Hope it works well.
I have seen some other designs like that one, so it must be good.  Please keep posting, even while you are on vacation if you can.  I can't wait to see your plans.

Cap-Z-ro,
Stubblefield did say that the core could be removed for repair purposes, so why not for experimenting?  It should be fine.  It is just in the way you put the coil together.  Make sure the hole for the bolt is large enough to remove the bolt with the insulating cover on it.  If you only make the hole large enough to put the bolt through, then you cover the bolt with tape, etc., the bolt wont be able to go back through the hole.  You would only need to make the holes just a tiny bit larger than usual.  I suppose you would also have to make sure the first winding was not too terribly tight on the bolt. 

Why couldn't you use a cardboard tube with the bolt inside?  If the tube was not too thick, wouldn't that work?  Put the bolt inside the cardboard tube, then wind the coil on the cardboard not the bolt.  Leave just enough room inside the tube to be able to remove the bolt.  Does that sound plausible?   I would imagine the thin cardboard tube should not impede the properties of the coil.  Anyone know for certain about that?  Maybe you could make  your own thin cardboard tube with some layers of paper not quite as thick as cardboard but thick enough to make a tube.

I think Jeanna used a straw on one of her coils, with the bolt inside, I am assuming.

IotaYodi

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Re: Nathan Stubblefield Earth battery/Self Generating Induction Coil Replications
« Reply #3136 on: February 25, 2010, 03:54:33 PM »
Quote
They retain their magnetism after the magnetic field is turned off.
You are going to have some retention with soft iron. You would need an opposing field or polarity to drop it back down to zero. A ferrite core may not have the field intensity like soft iron but may be doable.   

Pirate88179

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Re: Nathan Stubblefield Earth battery/Self Generating Induction Coil Replications
« Reply #3137 on: February 25, 2010, 06:25:31 PM »
I have been searching for ferrite rods for cores for some time now.  I think I posted this somewhere a good time ago, but now, thanks to Lasersaber, we have a good source for the cotton wire, I will bring it up again.  An alternative that is not very expensive and will allow for easy assembly/disassemble would be the 1" OD 5/$1 toroids from Goldmine.

I would not glue these in any way but, think about it, they could be stacked on a pvc or wood rod and bolted end to end to hold the stack of toroids together like a stack of pennies.  The coil could then be wound around the stack and it will be used as a solid core.

Even though the permeability of the goldmine toroids is not really known, many of us have made some really god JT circuits using them and for a really good JT circuit you need high permeability so I would guess it is pretty good.

We have been able to get some very high frequencies out of our little JT circuits with some really good back EMF spikes so I am confident that this ferrite material will easily keep up with any make/break system used in the NS coil.

If I am not clear on my explanation, let me know and I will attempt to make yet another very crude drawing.

Bill

the_big_m_in_ok

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Re: Nathan Stubblefield Earth battery/Self Generating Induction Coil Replications
« Reply #3138 on: February 25, 2010, 07:25:01 PM »
...  I had high hopes for those soft iron cores.  Now I have ten junk cores. I will now have to unwind my coils and make new ones with better cores in the future. ...
Just an offhand tip?
If soft (annealed) cores don't work for this application, then the typical American construction rebar hadn't ought to work any better.  The stuff is made out of soft cast iron, as far as I know.  It's easy to come by, though.

--Lee

protonmom

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Re: Nathan Stubblefield Earth battery/Self Generating Induction Coil Replications
« Reply #3139 on: February 25, 2010, 09:41:44 PM »
Got my bolts and ready to make some new coils. ;D
********************************
Here are two good reads.  First has some good vids to watch.  Both informative.

http://www.stmary.ws/highschool/physics/home/notes/electricity/magnetism/default.htm

St. Mary's Physics Online



http://info.ee.surrey.ac.uk/Workshop/advice/coils/force.html
The force produced by a magnetic field

*************************************

My ? of the day.    ???

Anyone know what Rad E 4 means, or more importantly, what would it have meant to Stubblefield or those scientists of that day?

Pirate88179

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Re: Nathan Stubblefield Earth battery/Self Generating Induction Coil Replications
« Reply #3140 on: February 25, 2010, 09:51:38 PM »
Protonmom:

RAD E 4 is ref. in a paper published in 1907 in the same publication that Einstein published his works in:

http://arxiv.org/PS_cache/arxiv/pdf/0804/0804.3836v3.pdf


The above 2008 paper explains it way better than I ever could.

It deals with the laws of thermodynamics.

Google results where I located the paper:

"Rad. E. 4, 411 (1907). [4] F. Jüttner, Ann. der Physik, Vol. 339, Issue 5, 856 (1911). [5] D. Blanu˘sa, Glasnik Mat.DFiz. i Astr., Ser. II 2, 249 (1947). ..."



Bill

protonmom

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Re: Nathan Stubblefield Earth battery/Self Generating Induction Coil Replications
« Reply #3141 on: February 25, 2010, 10:22:08 PM »
Thanks Bill,
That really didn't say much, huh?  I wonder if Stubbs might have used it in reference to his home-made heater they found in his shack?  I have no clue what that pdf was talking about.  Einstein, Tesla and Stubblefield were way above MY head.  Too bad they couldn't always talk in regular English so the rest of us could follow along. 

protonmom

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Re: Nathan Stubblefield Earth battery/Self Generating Induction Coil Replications
« Reply #3142 on: February 25, 2010, 11:52:36 PM »
I may have been closer than I thought.

1 rad = 100 ergs per gram 1 electron volt = 1.6E-12 ergs ... 1 Gauss = 1E-4 Tesla 1 Gauss = 1E-6 Volt-seconds per square centimeter. Length and Area ...
www.iem-inc.com/toolcnvr.html

No telling HOW Stubbs could have used the Rad E4. 

Surely there is a scientist hidden away somewhere on this forum who would know exactly what Rad E4 was and how it was used back in the 1800's-1900's.

electricme

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Re: Nathan Stubblefield Earth battery/Self Generating Induction Coil Replications
« Reply #3143 on: February 26, 2010, 06:32:59 AM »
@ Cap-Z-ro,

Not sure if it was specified how tight the coil must be wound on the core...and am wondering if coils can be made so that the cores can be interchangeable, for the purpose of experimental expediency.

Regards...

Looking at the patient, it seems that tidiness is a presquite to the stubblefield coil working correctly, if I'm right, I think the stubblefield Bifilar coils run at a lower voltage than at high voltage, it seems the bifilar function is to control the magnetic fields.
I read last night that stubblefield had a carbon resistance between the bifilar wires, so when the field collapsed, it still had some residual magnetism bouncing inside to restart the process after each cycle. Well it's a theory, one day we will know for sure.


The bifilar coils could be wound on a strong former, like a wooden dowel rod, covered by a rolled cardboard tube, perhaps it could be glued as the cardboard was rolled up, then when the stubblefield coil is made, the dowel rod is slid outwards, and several different metal rods could be tested to see how each performs.

jim
   

Mk1

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Re: Nathan Stubblefield Earth battery/Self Generating Induction Coil Replications
« Reply #3144 on: February 26, 2010, 07:10:58 AM »
Another thing,

I forget who it was, but someone mentioned using annealed iron.  How do you make your own annealed iron?  Do you put it in a bon-fire and cook the heck out of it, and let it cool off?  Will that do the trick?  How does annealing make it soft iron?  And what are the properties of soft iron that make it important in the coils?  does annealing make the iron more magnetic?

Lots of questions.   Anyone have the answers?  Thanks in advance.

Soft iron will better because it will not remain magnetized , and are better at directing polarity N/S. Under magnetic stress it becomes a magnet .

In commercial electromagnet its the only stuff used .

Mark


 

Mk1

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Re: Nathan Stubblefield Earth battery/Self Generating Induction Coil Replications
« Reply #3145 on: February 26, 2010, 07:20:34 AM »
Those are the very soft iron rods that I ordered.  I am not very happy with them.  They retain their magnetism after the magnetic field is turned off.  I think I am going to try a ferrite rod.  Maybe I will make a huge coil around this: http://www.stormwise.com/page26.htm  I am open to suggestions for a good ferrite rod to use.  I know very little about them.

Here is a design that I plan on building when I get back from my trip.  Based on testing that I have already been doing I am pretty sure this motor is going to run good. It will also to some extent accomplish the " make and break" switching.

Are you sure the rotor magnet are the right way (north vs south) also when the magnet of the rotor is close to the coil it is fair to assume the core is still magnetized , it may be a size issue or distance .

Also i don't see on the drawing the connection for the other ends of the coils .

Maybe you need a second reed switch to pulse it back and forth .

Anyhow great work!


Cap-Z-ro

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Re: Nathan Stubblefield Earth battery/Self Generating Induction Coil Replications
« Reply #3146 on: February 26, 2010, 10:46:26 AM »

Thanks pmom,

That is useful for trying more modern core materials, as someone suggested earlier.

Regards...


wintermuteai1

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Re: Nathan Stubblefield Earth battery/Self Generating Induction Coil Replications
« Reply #3147 on: February 27, 2010, 03:03:38 AM »
Greetings to everyone, new to the forum.
I have been doing a lot of research on Stubblefield as well as Tesla and others.
I also plan on building a Stubblefield device. My thoughts on it are these:
From what I have read it is believed that Stubblefield was forced to make changes to his wording in his patents to appease the patent office, so the terminology calls for electrolytic reaction which may be true so that it has this method as a primer. However, In reading the patent it seems clear that that is only a small part of the device. I estimate that the device once in the earth will become an electromagnet even without connecting the wires (5 & 6)(see NBS patent 600457 fig 4) due to the telluric current/ radiant energy within the earth. It should be noted that references were made to the fact of leaving the battery in the earth and it would build and build over time. As the telluric currents/radiant energy builds the soft iron core becomes magnetic exciting the coils of wire and making it an electromagnet creating the current that will be useable from wire 5 & 6 terminals. This alone is fantastic in itself, however I believe there is one thing that has perhaps been overlooked. If you examine the photographs of Stubblefield and his patent # 887357 he used this battery/induction coil in concert with a coil antenna. Usually with one as the transmitter and another setup with a receiver. However I would like to refer you to Nikola Tesla patent #685957 "The apparatus for the utilization of radiant energy". Note that with a wire antenna the signals pulled in will produce usable current. Stubblefield and Tesla knew each other as was seen in the photos. It is my hypothesis that the antenna is the means by which to truly "prime the pump". It was noticed that Stubblefield got more and more current build after doing this. I also think that it is important to have the secondary coil in place for obvious reasons. Hooking up the antenna coil to wires 5 & 6 utilizing the radiant energy going into the battery from the antenna we will therefore want the secondary coil to gather the resulting buildup of radiant energy to power a load.
I apologize if any of this has been already talked about as I am still reading over the 210 pages of this thread but wanted to get my thoughts out there.
Thank you.
-Wintermuteai1 
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Pirate88179

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Re: Nathan Stubblefield Earth battery/Self Generating Induction Coil Replications
« Reply #3148 on: February 27, 2010, 04:23:27 AM »
Wintermuteai1:

Welcome to our group.  I can not argue with your assessment of the patent.  I believe you may be correct.  NS always said you need to "prime the pump", whatever that meant.

This came up again with the work of Tariel Kapanadze where he used a car battery to get the electrons flowing and then disconnected it.  He is getting great output now from his experiments.


Again, welcome to the group.

Bill

wintermuteai1

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Re: Nathan Stubblefield Earth battery/Self Generating Induction Coil Replications
« Reply #3149 on: February 27, 2010, 04:28:04 AM »
Thank you Bill
I've watched your videos on youtube, great work!
also love the forum here. It is great to see so many people working toward common goals.