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[Steven Dufresne]

Paul and Vince,
Wow. Seriously out-of-the-box thinking there. Thanks.

Paul. It wouldn't be difficult at all to seal it for a single test. However, the box walls have to be removed each time I need to make adjustments to the spacing between the stator, rotor and HV plates, which is often as part of the experimental procedure. I can imagine sealing and unsealing would add a lot to that time unless I make a whole new box. Also, I need air flow over the motor; it heats up fast. So I'd need to add some other sort of cooling, possibly water. It's sounding just as simple to go with a new motor.

Vince. No problem trying that. I'd worry about air ionization being important though. I wouldn't want to blow it all away.
-Steve
http://rimstar.org   http://wsminfo.org
PS. Sorry for the delayed response. I was away Saturday.

[Steven Dufresne]

How difficult would it be to build an air tight box around the entire apparatus (or find
a suitable such box), and then connect a tube to a domestic vacuum cleaner in
order to reduce the air pressure and wind losses? (There might eventually be
overheating problems).

Paul,
Crazy as your idea sounds, I actually tried it. See the attached photo montage. I managed to drop the air pressure by about 1 inch Hg as you can see from the pressure gauge. At that point the outer acrylic window (there are two 1/8" layers of acrylic on the inside of the box and 1/8" layer on the outside) was seriously bowed inward so I didn't bother sealing better. There was no noticable improvement in speed - the best I could get was around 3900 RPM which I've gotten without the reduced air pressure. It was worth a try though.

I'm not sure what approach I'll take next. I might get some better but smaller diameter rotors fabricated or I might try changing the stator from a solid metal plate to a mesh as with the testatika or I might return to my vacuum cleaner motor (see first post to this thread) but with a shorter shaft. What I'd really like to do is find a dual shaft motor that can give me 6000 RPM with the load I have but so far I'm not finding anything better than what I have.
-Steve
http://rimstar.org   http://wsminfo.org

[Steven Dufresne]

I guessed that maybe if I sealed the area where each rotor is, once the air gets moving, since it's enclosed in a circular pathway, it will keep most of its momentum and act like less of a load and I'd be picking up less new dead air. I also guessed that it would have the opposite effect, but I had to try, especially since in the patent the rotors are sealed in a circular housing in the same manner.

I got 4500 RPM, an encouraging improvement over my previous best of around 4000 RPM.

I used clear packing tape so I wonder if I used something less crinkly if it would be even better. Still no HV spikes, but Hyde didn't get those until around 6000 RPM.

For anyone who wants to see the whole story in one place, I've started updating the webpage:
 http://rimstar.org/sdenergy/hyde_generator
-Steve
http://rimstar.org   http://wsminfo.org

[gotoluc]

Hi Steven,

I found one of your videos on YouTube and eventually got here

Knowing you a little, I would have to say that this Hyde generator must be quiet convincing

Your research work is impeccable and your video work is also top notch. It all looks very impressive to date.

From what I can quickly see, you are having an RPM limitation to be able to validate the Hyde generator. Is this still the current status?

Thanks for sharing.

Luc

[Steven Dufresne]

Hey Luc,
Good to hear from you again. I look in on your channel too every now and then. Always glad to see you're still at it.

You're right, I'm still stuck on the RPM issue.

But I also since contacted Hyde, the inventer, by leaving him a phone message with my website and email address in hopes of getting more details before proceeding with a new version. He wouldn't pick up when I called. Unfortunately all he told me via email was a rather brief statement that "HV leaks off a lot of materials" and then in response to my further prompting "thanks for your interest but this Advanced Energy Technology is still in court and I cant make much comment about it."

So from that I take it that my next version should have less sharp edges, more like the patent's thick metal segments.

I've also since tried adapting the Hyde geometry to the testatika and done some tests there do to the seeming correlations, but no success so far.
-Steve

[gotoluc]

Did you try higher voltage to the motor to get more RPM's by using your variac?  since many variac's can output higher than the 120v grid voltage.

If that's not enough you can use 2 variac's on separate phases to go higher.

You are so close! it would be sad to rebuild just to verify if it's indeed true that the magic starts at 6,000 RPM

If you need a second variac to do the test I''ll be glad to come over and help if you wish.

Luc

[Steven Dufresne]

Actually my last runs have been with the motor controller plugged directly into the grid, no variac, and I turn the motor controller up full. So I'm using the maximum I can get from the grid, without adding phases.

Also, the motor documentation says it's rated for 110V so I wouldn't want to go too much higher out of fear of damaging the motor.

Plus, the number of extra RPMs I get per added volts in is small. To get the last 1500 RPM I'd have to increase the voltage substantially. Keep in mind that the faster I turn it the bigger the load from the air, and doesn't that go up as the square of the velocity?

I may just have to go back to using the vacuum cleaner motor (see first post in this topic) but with a new straighter and shorter shaft than I tried before; 10" instead of 16".
-Steve
http://rimstar.org   http://wsminfo.org

[Paul-R]

Another way to go in the reduced pressure direction would be to put the
gear in a heavy steel box, and look out for an old secondhand laboratory
vacuum pump, possibly from Ebay.

[gotoluc]

Is the motor an induction motor?   if so, then it's brushless and it's only experiencing slip because the field coils are too weak to keep the rotor in sync with the load and more volts will strengthen the field coils to correct this. An induction motor can take more volts without any damage as long as the temperature of the field coils do not exceed 120 Celsius. So if the motor is not experiencing a heat issue at this time I would say it's worth a try. If you only knew how much Thane Heins induction motor heated under load and showed no sign of damage

Anyways, you only need it to reach the 6,000 RPM mark for maybe 60 seconds to confirm if the magic starts so there's no way this short of a voltage burst will have any time to heat the coils.

I do also have a couple of remote digital thermostats with 3 foot probe if you want to monitor the temperature.

Let me know if you need anything.

Luc

 

[Steven Dufresne]

Is the motor an induction motor?   if so, then it's brushless and it's only experiencing slip because the field coils are too weak to keep the rotor in sync with the load and more volts will strengthen the field coils to correct this. An induction motor can take more volts without any damage as long as the temperature of the field coils do not exceed 120 Celsius. So if the motor is not experiencing a heat issue at this time I would say it's worth a try. If you only knew how much Thane Heins induction motor heated under load and showed no sign of damage

I just checked the exploded view diagram from the manual and there are two brushes. Anyone know if it's okay to run these at well over their rated voltage and current (110VAC, 1.5A under load)? I guess I can put an ammeter in series and see what my current draw is.

Anyways, you only need it to reach the 6,000 RPM mark for maybe 60 seconds to confirm if the magic starts so there's no way this short of a voltage burst will have any time to heat the coils.

I do also have a couple of remote digital thermostats with 3 foot probe if you want to monitor the temperature.

Good point. I have the same with 10 foot probes. The motor housing does get hot during a minute or so run.

Let me know if you need anything.

Luc

Actually Luc, if you want to drop by some time even if just to exchange ideas you're more than welcome. I know I've plenty to share that'd be impractical through email. Just send me private email or call (613-748-7810).
-Steve
http://rimstar.org   http://wsminfo.org

[gotoluc]

I just checked the exploded view diagram from the manual and there are two brushes. Anyone know if it's okay to run these at well over their rated voltage and current (110VAC, 1.5A under load)? I guess I can put an ammeter in series and see what my current draw is.

Unfortunately in this case I would not recommend to do this to a brushed motor as the extra current could start melting the commutator surface and basically ruin the motor.

I'll give you a call.

Luc

[Steven Dufresne]

Thanks to Luc, I got back on the horse and pulled away from testatika/hyde hybrid back to the pure hyde generator. 5200 RPM! Only 800 RPM to go. Full details and photos can be found at (scroll down to under the heading starting "May 19"):
 http://rimstar.org/sdenergy/hyde_generator/index.htm
but here's a brief writeup and of course I couldn't resist a photo of the segment that went bang (see below.)

Luc pointed out to me how to get 2 phases out of my wall sockets to get up to 220VAC and even more using variacs (which I didn't realize variacs would do), but for starters I tried it with just one variac at its maximum output of 130VAC. I got 4660 RPM! My previous best at 4500 RPM at 110VAC so it looks like I'd get around 80 RPM for each 10VAC I add; not much.

Then I decided that since I had big success on May 5 with sealing just the area where the rotors were and since at 4660 RPM it was screaming like a banshee from the air coming out of the holes in the wooden box, I should seal the area where the motor was too, just as is done in the patent. Success, I got 5200 RPM! Only 800 RPM to go.

And then there was a muffled bang and the whole thing began to slowly slide across the floor. One of the segments flew off (the bang) and that unbalanced the rotor (the slow slide.) But thanks to you guys, it was totally safe and nothing came out of the box. Damage was limited to a small cut in the packing tape that was sealing the rotor/stator area and mangling of the segment.
-Steve
http://rimstar.org   http://wsminfo.org

[Steven Dufresne]

Thought I'd give an update on how this week's experimenting went. I think I hit a limit on how well my glue (Advanced Formula Instant Krazy Glue - gel type since that gives me about 15-30 seconds of play time) can hold the steel segments to the acrylic disks because another one flew off this week and had to be repaired. On the bright side, I did hit 5500 RPM with the improved housing I made.

I've ordered some higher current diodes for my circuit. I don't know what my current ones are rated at but I'm sure it's micro, if not milliamps. I have 200 1000V, 6A silicon diodes on order (6A100.) If this thing's going to start putting out real current at some time, I want to be ready for it.

Once I've got the new diodes in place I'll also experiment with mesh for the sectors, taking a page from testatika.
-Steve
http://rimstar.org   http://wsminfo.org

[leo48]

HEI steve how's your work for the generator HYDE?
thanks
leo48

[Steven Dufresne]

HEI A how's your work for the generator HYDE?

Hi @leo48,
Sorry for the lack of updates. The new diodes I mentioned in my previous post didn't help. Also, the test using mesh for stators mentioned above didn't help either.

The last thing I did was to modify one of my power supplies to put out both HV+ and HV-, both with respect to ground:
 http://rimstar.org/equip/pos_neg_voltage_multiplier.htm
It's a Cockroft-Walton voltage multiplier and puts out HV DC with some ripple. The problem I've found over the years is that if there's ionization going on somewhere then that ripple becomes hugely amplified. And unfortunately that's what happened when I tried it with my Hyde generator. All the connecting wiring was fine so I guess there's ionization going on in the Hyde generator. I'll need to build new stators and end plates to get rid of the leakage before it's worth testing again. I'm working on some other approaches right now though but I'll get back to the Hyde generator eventually. I'll post back here when I do.
-Steve
http://rimstar.org   http://wsminfo.org
PS. In case anyone's curious, here's the experiment I did with testatika where I first ran into this ripple amplification:
 http://rimstar.org/sdenergy/testa/potsmk1.htm
and here's what I'm doing now:
 http://rimstar.org/sdenergy/vacuum_energy/index.htm