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Author Topic: Thread for naysayers, nitpickers, and shills  (Read 62846 times)

Offline Cap-Z-ro

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Thread for naysayers, nitpickers, and shills
« on: January 01, 2014, 07:08:40 PM »
This thread was put up for the express purpose of debunking all free energy devices presented on ou.com...thereby protecting the gullible from being fleeced or wasting their time on things placed in their path to keep them busy on fruitless pursuits.

BUT...there are a number of reasons why this concept will not 'fly'.

No audience to perform in front of to show how clever they are.

Because nobody here has the attention span to stay focused long enough to comprehend the long winded rhetoric.

If left alone for any length  of time, people tend to inspire each others thought process through the free flow of ideas and open unfettered discussion...which could very well lead to accessible free energy technology = freedom from global slavery.

After this thread fades into oblivion...every time somebody offers up their ideas, it would be very revealing if someone would immediately post up a thread for the debunkers...separating the wheat from the chaff, so to speak.

Or how ever you want to look at it.

My guess is that there would be very little activity there, and even less views.

Regards...



Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy


Offline TechStuf

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Re: Thread for naysayers, nitpickers, and shills
« Reply #1 on: January 02, 2014, 11:34:02 AM »

You are, of course, right in your assessment.  It used to be on most forums I've visited, that it was mostly the adolescents who posted in the sophomoric fashion that is the mainstay of the curmudgeons haunting the halls here at OU.

It is really quite formulaic really.  If put to analysis, I'm sure the case could certainly be made for "organized interference".

I submit the following link as a possible candidate to serve as a permanent alternative for the trolls.

A real ass clown haven.

http://www.popforum.net/viewforum.php?f=5

I can see the debates raging now....."My admittedly neophytic and obviously ill motivated refutation is more relevant than yours"......"no it isn't"....."yes it is".....

Times infinity.


TS

Offline Hoppy

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Re: Thread for naysayers, nitpickers, and shills
« Reply #2 on: January 02, 2014, 02:01:17 PM »
The problem with this type of thread is that the naysayers, nitpickers and shills will have to keep copying over all those 'iffy' self-running video's for eyeball analysis, so I can't see how having to do this will tempt them over to this thread. Its much better to have a face-to-face discussion about issues arising. Those that have the confidence to post self-running videos, or tell the naysayers, nitpickers and shills that they are badly misguided by their conventional electrical education, or suggest that a discussion between parties having opposing views or beliefs is disrupting progress, should also have the confidence to fight their corner, rather than asking the 'other side' to retire into a separate room to chat amongst themselves. C'mon man, which side are you on, or are you just sitting in the middle contributing very little and throwing stones to aggravate and disrupt progress??

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: Thread for naysayers, nitpickers, and shills
« Reply #2 on: January 02, 2014, 02:01:17 PM »
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Offline gauschor

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Re: Thread for naysayers, nitpickers, and shills
« Reply #3 on: January 02, 2014, 02:45:33 PM »
Nothing works, so I say nay.

Offline poynt99

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Re: Thread for naysayers, nitpickers, and shills
« Reply #4 on: January 02, 2014, 03:08:56 PM »
The problem with this type of thread is that the naysayers, nitpickers and shills will have to keep copying over all those 'iffy' self-running video's for eyeball analysis, so I can't see how having to do this will tempt them over to this thread. Its much better to have a face-to-face discussion about issues arising. Those that have the confidence to post self-running videos, or tell the naysayers, nitpickers and shills that they are badly misguided by their conventional electrical education, or suggest that a discussion between parties having opposing views or beliefs is disrupting progress, should also have the confidence to fight their corner, rather than asking the 'other side' to retire into a separate room to chat amongst themselves. C'mon man, which side are you on, or are you just sitting in the middle contributing very little and throwing stones to aggravate and disrupt progress??
You got it Hoppy. Happy New Year to you!
 :D


Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: Thread for naysayers, nitpickers, and shills
« Reply #4 on: January 02, 2014, 03:08:56 PM »
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Offline tim123

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Re: Thread for naysayers, nitpickers, and shills
« Reply #5 on: January 02, 2014, 04:58:02 PM »
'Shill': noun:
 "an accomplice of a confidence trickster or swindler who poses as a genuine customer to entice or encourage others."

It's clear to me that the technically competent experimenters who like clear answers are not shills...

The shills are the people who apparently believe all the mistaken, deluded, and sometimes fraudulent claims, and then constantly cheer-lead for them, despite a total lack of evidence...

If this thread is an attempt to divert technical investigation, and the inevitable criticism, of Luc's as yet undefined 'reactive' effect, then I don't suppose it'll work. If I can be bothered to ask Luc any questions - which he only ignores anyway - then I'll do it on the main topic - not this one.

Regards, Tim

Offline Hoppy

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Re: Thread for naysayers, nitpickers, and shills
« Reply #6 on: January 02, 2014, 05:28:59 PM »
'Shill': noun:
 "an accomplice of a confidence trickster or swindler who poses as a genuine customer to entice or encourage others."

It's clear to me that the technically competent experimenters who like clear answers are not shills...

The shills are the people who apparently believe all the mistaken, deluded, and sometimes fraudulent claims, and then constantly cheer-lead for them, despite a total lack of evidence...

If this thread is an attempt to divert technical investigation, and the inevitable criticism, of Luc's as yet undefined 'reactive' effect, then I don't suppose it'll work. If I can be bothered to ask Luc any questions - which he only ignores anyway - then I'll do it on the main topic - not this one.

Regards, Tim

Valid point about shills. I think the captain needs to remove shills from the title of this thread.

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: Thread for naysayers, nitpickers, and shills
« Reply #6 on: January 02, 2014, 05:28:59 PM »
Sponsored links:




Offline Cap-Z-ro

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Re: Thread for naysayers, nitpickers, and shills
« Reply #7 on: January 02, 2014, 06:21:07 PM »
The problem with this type of thread is that the naysayers, nitpickers and shills will have to keep copying over all those 'iffy' self-running video's for eyeball analysis, so I can't see how having to do this will tempt them over to this thread. "


Didn't I not just say just that, with these words in the preamble opening up this thread ?

[This thread was put up for the express purpose of debunking all free energy devices presented on ou.com...thereby protecting the gullible from being fleeced or wasting their time on things placed in their path to keep them busy on fruitless pursuits.

BUT...there are a number of reasons why this concept will not 'fly'.]

Surely you should know better that to try to paint me as a delusional fool...especially in such an obvious fashion.

Apparently not it seems.

Any participation in that model would constitute a tacit admission of being a naysayer, nitpicker, or a shill...hello ?

TechStuf, with whom I have a standing disagreement on a particular issue with, but who technical knowledge I respect seemed to have no problem grasping the meaning and of my words and the intent  of this thread...no so however, for some others who instead predictably somehow found fly paper in the thread.

Instead, the unspoken intention of this thread was to shed some light on the various distraction tactics (alluded to by TechStuf) employed by those who fit the naysayers, nitpickers, and shills, profile.



"Its much better to have a face-to-face discussion about issues arising."

According to past behavior, this ALWAYS amounts to conflict and confrontation and an exit by the builder, and no expansion of discussion...as planned.


 
" Those that have the confidence to post self-running videos, or tell the naysayers, nitpickers and shills that they are badly misguided by their conventional electrical education, or suggest that a discussion between parties having opposing views or beliefs is disrupting progress, should also have the confidence to fight their corner,"


'Those' you refer to are not here to fight...only to share.

Why not simply open your own thread to debunk their ideas and save us gullible hayseeders from being duped ?

The answer is of course, nobody will attend that party...and nobody will be there to fight or badger before the crowd.

This lot is easily identified by their lack of contribution to the development a particular concept...they never offer help, only criticism and conflict.

 

" C'mon man, which side are you on, or are you just sitting in the middle contributing very little and throwing stones to aggravate and disrupt progress??


Projecting ones social infirmities onto a perceived is the lowest and most desperate form of debate...and a subconscious admission of defeat.




Is everybody in yet ? Apparently not yet.


Quote from Tim:

" 'Shill': noun:
 "an accomplice of a confidence trickster or swindler who poses as a genuine customer to entice or encourage others."

Pretending that I am not referencing 'shills' paid by 'the powers that be' to suppress free energy tech belies an attempt prevent me bringing awareness to that activity, don't you think ?



" It's clear to me that the technically competent experimenters who like clear answers are not shills..."


What 'experimenters' ?  All I am seeing so far are the 'naysayers, nitpickers, and shills'.

Personally speaking, when I am "experimenting" I actually do an 'experiment'...until then, I'm just talking about experimenting.




" The shills are the people who apparently believe all the mistaken, deluded, and sometimes fraudulent claims, and then constantly cheer-lead for them, despite a total lack of evidence..."


Really now ?  Thats very odd indeed, because I see people contributing ideas and sharing their thoughts.

If you are referring to Chet/Ramset...I see nothing wrong or counterproductive with his optimism and enthusiasm.



" If this thread is an attempt to divert technical investigation, and the inevitable criticism, of Luc's as yet undefined 'reactive' effect, then I don't suppose it'll work. If I can be bothered to ask Luc any questions - which he only ignores anyway - then I'll do it on the main topic - not this one."


I am a pretty good judge of horse flesh...and Luc is being open and honest (sharing)

If Luc is ignoring your questions, I'm quite certain he has a valid reason.

To persist with incessant repetitive questions under those conditions you've stated is disruptive and an annoyance to anyone who wishes to follow the natural progression of the subject.


Apologies to Tinman...error corrected

Offline Farmhand

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Re: Thread for naysayers, nitpickers, and shills
« Reply #8 on: January 02, 2014, 07:23:40 PM »
This thread was put up for the express purpose of debunking all free energy devices presented on ou.com...thereby protecting the gullible from being fleeced or wasting their time on things placed in their path to keep them busy on fruitless pursuits.

BUT...there are a number of reasons why this concept will not 'fly'.

No audience to perform in front of to show how clever they are.

Because nobody here has the attention span to stay focused long enough to comprehend the long winded rhetoric.

If left alone for any length  of time, people tend to inspire each others thought process through the free flow of ideas and open unfettered discussion...which could very well lead to accessible free energy technology = freedom from global slavery.

After this thread fades into oblivion...every time somebody offers up their ideas, it would be very revealing if someone would immediately post up a thread for the debunkers...separating the wheat from the chaff, so to speak.

Or how ever you want to look at it.

My guess is that there would be very little activity there, and even less views.

Regards...

The part in bold kind of implies that there are people who actually want to debunk all free energy devices, that is simply not true, we want more free energy, at least I do, but I don't do replications much, I usually try to get the same effects as people show in a different way.

Anyway I think more than anything there is some confusion of terms, and things get over complicated.

I think you've confused Tinman with Tim, different people.

It is true, a shill is a magicians assistant or a conman's assistant, nothing to do with a skeptic.

The experiments in question are very similar to many experiments already done by a few of us, we don;t always video tape everything unless it seems interesting or useful. Useful is good even if not OU, sometimes a means to an end.

I and others have shown video's of the acceleration under load and short circuit, which Luc promoted, I did it with two different setups and without high impedance coils, one setup with fairly dramatic results, I have also shown videos of transformer experiments akin to the so called (delayed Lenz transformer effect) with reduced input under load (from a battery) with home made switching circuits and transformers using basically the same effect but done differently. With the batteries in the transformer experiments showing a reduced load on them when the output is loaded, the battery voltage is seen to rise under output loading.

Acceleration under load short clip.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iFWin-crxQY

Longer clip. Part 2
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TV_dm8COKBY

Transformer effects. Transformer has grounded neutral like the grid.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zxde9qga79c

With 12 volt input Tesla coil AC generator and Tesla coil output transformer in resonance.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZYc6nN8MWAM

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WRzQ_CO9vnw

Others have done quite accurate replications and seen the much the same results and causes I did.

Maybe I'll drive that transformer from the grid for my experiment, not sure yet.

..



 


Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: Thread for naysayers, nitpickers, and shills
« Reply #8 on: January 02, 2014, 07:23:40 PM »
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Offline tim123

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Re: Thread for naysayers, nitpickers, and shills
« Reply #9 on: January 02, 2014, 07:36:43 PM »
If Luc is ignoring your questions, I'm quite certain he has a valid reason.

I asked him for the full specifications for the motor he was using. (And the generator too, but he hasn't 'shared' that yet...)

It took 3 goes, and many weeks, before he finally relented, and revealed the fact that it contained it's own capacitor.

That fact should have been in the very first video. That it wasn't, is *at best* a serious omission - because it affects his results - a lot.

So no, he really did not have a valid reason.

Regards, Tim

Offline Bob Smith

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Re: Thread for naysayers, nitpickers, and shills
« Reply #10 on: January 02, 2014, 08:02:44 PM »
Naysayers, nitpickers, shills -
Their antics can give one the chills.
Their vitriol joust
That's crafted to oust
Might just be how they pay the bills! :o

Consider just what some are stating,
Like onslaughts that know no abating -
They insult a man
To discredit his plan:
Not a real healthy way of relating.

But such is the way of the shill -
Who undermines truth for his swill.
Bought-off or compromised
To keep new thought sanitized,
His conscience within he must still.

But sure tricks there are, to survive.
They're crucial to staying alive.
Just don't take the bait
With derision or hate.
Simply post and move on, and you'll thrive. :)

Bob
(who used to be a poet, then stopped, but started again, but might stop now, but might not...)





Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: Thread for naysayers, nitpickers, and shills
« Reply #10 on: January 02, 2014, 08:02:44 PM »
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Offline tim123

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Re: Thread for naysayers, nitpickers, and shills
« Reply #11 on: January 02, 2014, 08:06:12 PM »
...Simply post and move on, and you'll thrive. :)

:D

That was awesome.

Offline Cap-Z-ro

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Re: Thread for naysayers, nitpickers, and shills
« Reply #12 on: January 02, 2014, 08:13:45 PM »
The part in bold kind of implies that there are people who actually want to debunk all free energy devices, that is simply not true, we want more free energy, at least I do, but I don't do replications much, I usually try to get the same effects as people show in a different way.


You can only speak for yourself on that...history and the goings on here tell quite a different story I'm afraid.



" Anyway I think more than anything there is some confusion of terms, and things get over complicated.

It is true, a shill is a magicians assistant or a conman's assistant, nothing to do with a skeptic. "


Please do not put words in my mouth...everyone here knows very well what I mean by 'shill'.



" I think you've confused Tinman with Tim, different people."

A simple clerical error which has been corrected.

I also confuse you with Forrest sometimes...but I am very clear on everything else.


" The experiments in question are very similar to many experiments already done by a few of us, we don;t always video tape everything unless it seems interesting or useful. Useful is good even if not OU, sometimes a means to an end."


Only problem is, we never seem to get to see that 'end' around here...due to the efforts of paid Gov shills.

The reason why I am trying to familiarize everyone here with these tactics, is so that when the shills start doing their schtick it will be readily apparent and someone other than myself will notice and circumvent the scumbaggery protocol.

 


" I and others have shown video's of the acceleration under load and short circuit, which Luc promoted, I did it with two different setups and without high impedance coils, one setup with fairly dramatic results, I have also shown videos of transformer experiments akin to the so called (delayed Lenz transformer effect) with reduced input under load (from a battery) with home made switching circuits and transformers using basically the same effect but done differently. With the batteries in the transformer experiments showing a reduced load on them when the output is loaded, the battery voltage is seen to rise under output loading. "



I'm sorry that you now feel the need to qualify yourself...its not necessary, we all know who's doing what in here.

Its just before now, that nobody was willing to poynt out the elephant or elephants in the room.

Regards...


 

Offline Cap-Z-ro

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Re: Thread for naysayers, nitpickers, and shills
« Reply #13 on: January 02, 2014, 08:21:01 PM »
:D

That was awesome.



Thanks Bob - very well done...happy to have played a small role in stirring your creative juices.

Never stop...I'm a bit of a dabbler myself...my specialty is milestone birthdays and pre mortem euology's.

Regards...


Offline tim123

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Re: Thread for naysayers, nitpickers, and shills
« Reply #14 on: January 02, 2014, 08:21:32 PM »
CapZRo, your last post is unreadable - please take the time to quote & reply properly - by ending and re-starting the quote tags.

Regards, Tim

 

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